Bule (Caucasian) Guy Dating Indonesian Girl

I came across this article the other day, and saw that the post got 239 comments. The author and the main contributor of the blog, remains anonymous so I wouldn’t know whether it’s a guy or a lady. A lady named Parvita left a lengthy comment and I guess that was when everybody started the subject of discussion: an expatriate (by expatriate I think she meant a Caucasian) guy vs. Indonesian girl.

I don’t understand why this became a topic anyway? It’s a preference that people make, like I like orange more than grape, or I prefer Frank Gehry rather than Norman Foster. Some people prefer to like Caucasians, some only choose Asians, etc. It’s a taste. You can’t tell people what or who to like or dislike.

But then throw some spices on the relationship between Caucasian and Indonesian, namely money, and this becomes a horrendous subject. Like what Indonesian girls do are so taboo and so sophisticated no other ethnic groups do that. So what if one side has money and is ready to throw it to anything that is covered with skirt, and the other side is ready to surrender for whatever it takes as long as their taxi ride and meal are paid. If you want to say that both sides are stupid, that’s ok. But that’s the choice that they deliberately make, and both know the consequences. It doesn’t matter whether we are Caucasians, Asians, Africans, etc. Why make such a fuss because there are people from different genders date (or have sex)?

Is it bad because of money involved? Then what would they say about this millionaire dating site? It’s specifically dedicated to people who are looking for dates who earns at least a million (I assume in US Dollar currency). Some people are so certain about the criteria of their partner(s) and they are not ashamed of drawing a borderline between what they want and what they actually could tolerate. Some can go as far whether she would date a baldie or not, or whether she would date a guy shorter than Tom Cruise or not. But some are very précised and know what they really, really want, including how much money their partner’s minimum earnings.

And how about an Indonesian girl who’s looking for (or dating for) money with Indonesian guy? My old post Upgraded Girls already talked about this subject. It’s everywhere too, except that it’s probably unseen because hey, we have the same skin colour and oh, probably because Indonesians are much more discreet because they have to save face, they can’t do what the Caucasian obnoxiously do, so they’d rather go behind the curtains (of karaoke bars probably) with loads of girls serving while they’re singing. How many of you have a friend or know someone who is a mistress of an Indonesian guy? I encountered one, and she’s having a good time, because she could treat a bunch of friends to stay in private villas in Bali (two villas at one visit, each costs close to USD 200 per day, with its own swimming pool, butler, and breakfast served at the spot), complete with cars and drivers, got the best table in clubs, before jetted off to Singapore for shopping trip the next month. Don’t tell me she’s being a mistress for love! I’ve got lots of stories similar to this, and usually the Indonesian girls are not poor, they’re just greedy and want to keep up with the latest handbag trends.

But again, it’s about choice. It’s like choosing job, or house, or clothes. If the (Indonesian) girls look for easy ways and choose to have fun for free, so beat it. I’m sure behind everybody’s back they tell their friends how stupid the bule guy spending so much money buying them expensive watch and paying for their mobile phone bills just for 20 minutes time (probably less) of their life. And the buy guy will brag to his friends how he scored 2 girls in one night for cheap price.

What I don’t understand, and this seems like a virus across Jakarta, is then if the casual dating becomes a relationship. My article Open Up and Say… Aaahhh! expressed how confused I was to see my Caucasian friends (who are smart, descent, have good jobs, and not like Parvita claimed cannot compete in their own countries. See, some Caucasians do look for serious relationships) choose to have a girlfriend or are married to Indonesian girls who, I must say here, are not equal to them? I’m not talking about money here. I’m talking about other other essence: educations. language, and cultural understandings. I point out education here because I couldn’t imagine my friend, a guy who is a finance director of a multinational company, comes home to a girl who doesn’t even speak English. What would he share with her about what happened to him during the day? Would she listen when he tells her about the conference call with head office?

Then what happen to the rest of smart, descent, Indonesian girls who happen to date or are married to Caucasians? They’re from educated, well off family, have their own jobs (mostly very good ones in multinational companies), and can afford whatever the guys would offer, whether they’re Caucasians or Indonesians. But they demand to be treated well. Because they damn right know that they are entitled to it and ask for no less. Hmm…. another label to make up.

I guess regardless of our skin colour, we could end up with jerks or saints. And if we’re lucky enough, we would find someone who are smart and descent, who treats us with love, honesty and respects.

It’s our own choice.

 

Comments

  1. Yeah, said, isn’t it, how expats are seen here. Even the expats here often says, “I’m not like other expats”. What are other expats like?

    You must have read the Indonesia Matter website. Yup, that article gave tons of response, didn’t it. You can write almost all sort of things including BS in that forum. Take it with a grain of salt.

    You should also read Thang Nguyen’s blog about his comments on Expats who likes pembantu look woman. Now that one was a big kick, it was also posted in Jakarta Post.

    Anyways, beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. And there must be some exceptions. I have to admit my post was a generalisation. I do see once in a while those who are decent and competitive, that are pretty useful in this country. Cheers.

    • I think your post is so cynical and so uncharacterictic of the sweet culture in Indonesia. You must have grown up abroad.

      1st there are more Indonesians trying to get in to America than the other way around

      2nd. How can you say it’s because we can not compete. I choose an Indonesian girl because they have qualities important to me than sadly many american girls do not have

      3rd – Although I might make less money than you unless you have above 2 master degree I have more than you. So how does that many me unproductive in your country. How many Indonesians that come here seek government assistance.

      4th. You would think you would be honored many men find Indonesians sweet, beautiful loyal and many other qualities

      My guess is you were burned by a foreigner and now hate any expatriate.

      Giving money for love is stupid. But their area many stupid girls that want it. Live and let live

  2. johnorford says:

    The way I see it, you have two ppl and they’re a couple. If they’re happy together they stay as a couple, if not they break up.

    It’s COMPLETELY STUPID to come up with all these bizarro theories about them, cos it doesn’t matter – for whatever reason they are happier together than apart – basically other ppl should butt out!

  3. Actually I think there’s nothing wrong as I have dated Bule girls because there are no Indonesians where I grew up. But in America interracial dating is a hot topic particularly between blacks and whites. Regarding that particular issue, there is some belief that dating a light-skinned individual is a sign of self-hate. At one point in US history, we were taught that light-skin was attractive and blacks at one point did whatever they can to pass off as white. Years later we see a diversity in beauty in the media. Unfortunately that’s not the case for some Asian countries (India, South Korea and Indonesia) where standard of beauty is based on being light and fair skinned as shown through their media advertisements (maybe because of colonialism). I believe Malaysia went as far as to ban advertisements with Brad Pitt because he is not reflective of the Malaysian people. All in all, beauty is in the eyes of the beholder yada yada yada. But human nature can not be simplified by simple truths (love and so forth). We are complex human beings where there are subconscious forces that dictate our actions. Again, I may sound like hypocrite but everyone has the right to do what they want and for the most part people are geneuninely in love. But I wouldn’t doubt there are a few cases when its not especially if it effects the self-esteem of a country. My 2 cents worth 181.868 rupiahs.

    ~Tuan – Indonesian American Muslim

  4. Jakartass says:

    Parvita: ‘said‘ or ‘sadhow expats are seen“?

    If “sad”, then you should look inwards. Just what is your problem that you have to foist your generalisations onto folk you don’t, presumably, make the effort to get to know.

    You do seem to have an obsession with folk of other nationalities here, don’t you. Do you also obsess about Indonesians from other regions? Or perhaps you’re one of those Indonesian women who use skin whitener?

    And as for those expats “who are decent and competitive, that are pretty useful in this country“, I do hope that you mean ‘co-operative‘.

    You write about “retarded” children, an indication of your condescension to those who don’t reach your “bar”.

    A.S., who commented elsewhere, suggests that you turn to religion and sort yourself out. He also says that “the Westerner will only find sin, ugliness and hypocrisy.

    He’s wrong. You’re not a westerner.

  5. Sorry to be bitchy honey, but you are living in Scotland, with a bule. you did what every Indo girl dreams about – getting out. Doesn’t matter if the bule is 60 years old, pot bellied, bald and senile. it gets you out of Indonesia.

    Of course when they are out they dump the silly old fool, and play the pack, looking for better catches. I know several Indo divorcees (and Thia, Philipino, Cambodian etc) who hang around bars in Sydney who have done exactly that.

  6. Chewwyuk,
    That’s the generalization you’ve perceived and developed because you hang out a lot in blok M when you visit Jakarta, or perhaps, you hang out with sad Indonesian women too in Sydney who are originally from Blok M. Therefore I said that people should start thinking about different labelling here (*snigger), since my friends and I don’t really fit into the ‘normal’ perception about stupid, uneducated, pembantu lookalike, can’t speak English, Indonesian girls, who are after money from sad old men. We don’t need money, we have plenty of our own from our good jobs. We certainly don’t need to lean on to someone to get a passport or to get out of this country.

    But I know what you mean, and I already pointed it out on my different posting. But why only put the blame on the Indonesian girl? The bule is old enough to know that noone young and sane enough will after him because of his look, it’s always money. So everybody happy, period. Who we are to judge, as John Orford mentioned, there are only 2 people in the relationship.

  7. Just wondering what’s wrong with Caucasian guy dating Indonesian girl , why people are bitching around about that. It’s just the matter of preference, and what’s wrong if your partner happened to be in lighter skin than yourself? You are in love with the person, not with the skin tone/race.

    How about we change the situation to “Caucasian woman dating Indonesian Boy”. Does people will still bitch around about that as well?

  8. OK, lets check my generalisation.

    Anita, what is the age difference between you and your husband…..?

  9. Chewwyuk,
    I knew you’re gonna ask this, so please read this and think that I’m writing this with a big, big smile:
    I’m 32 (i’ll be 33 in December) and my husband has just turned 38 this September. So 5 years, if you’re lazy to calculate.

    Far from 60, eh??

  10. Seems that all of you got the wrong message. The article posted which Anita tried to write again in her blog was about expats. Not about interracial marriage or dating. Look up in the dictionary what expat means. Caucasians are not expats if they live in the country. Indonesians are expats when they live abroad. Not about skin color.

    Indonesia is a place where expats, especially from the west, LOVE to stay in. It is cheap living here. Drivers, nice cars, big apartments, maids, those are some of the things they cannot afford back in their countries. All of a sudden they become the center of attention. Indonesia is where men’s fantasies become close to reality. Ask any expats, especially the single ones. White, brown, yellow. The white ones, or bule’s stands out like a sore thumb among the brown coloured ones. Like Asian women in Europe. They are different, therefore they are attractive.

    Nothing wrong about interracial marriage. And what I wrote originally is not about that. It is about how lots of expats here, who are so-so back at where they are, because overvalued here. The connotation among lots of Indonesian women here is that bule’ equals lots of money (and a lot of them do well financially in Indonesia). And to expat men, a lot of them here, Indonesia is paradise when it comes to women. From sexual point of view up to how submissive and warm Indonesian women can be. Pretty much mutual symbiosis here.

    Some people say the expats treat women better compared to the Indonesian men. To some extent, I might agree. What they forget is that each carry different values. And there are “kampung” expats here as well, those who are extremely shocked how they become a star, how they stand out and how friendly people are to them. And then, pathetically, they believe that they are gods. While in fact, they are average.

    Yeah, it’s sad.

  11. Ouch, score Nit!
    Chewwyuk, you really need to hang out at the right bars. It’s not everything about money, and even if money talks, so be it, it’s their own business.
    And as John Orford mentioned, there are only 2 people in the relationship

  12. Jakartass says:

    Has it ever crossed your mind, Parvita, that some folk who are invited into this country to pass on their skills, experience, knowledge et al, end up staying, not because they’re ‘failures’ back home but because the climate is kinder here, or their work is never finished, or they fall in love, or they have a specific interest, or …

    I certainly didn’t come for nookie; I was given a contract and a return ticket and I could easily have returned ‘home’ to my London flat (apartment) and found further employment or lived quite comfortably on the dole.

    Apart from falling in love 18 or so years ago, I chose to stay here because nearly every day there’s a “what-the’f**k’ moment. It’s that sense of curiosity that will never be assuaged in my lifetime which keeps me here.

    And, Parvita, you are just one more example of a curiosity. What the f**k is your problem that just one Caucasian expat should cause you so much angst that you have to lay your bitchiness on everyone else. This means that you are being psycho-analysed online by umpteen folk who you don’t know, including me, which leads me to suggest that you are displaying a high degree of masochism.

    You know, Parvita, what most of ‘us’ find sad is how extremely condescending you are. You have absolutely no idea how ‘we’ live, what our aspirations and motivations are, yet you, a jilted Indonesian, presume to comment on a lifestyle which you can only imagine. Unless, of course, you are one of those ayam down Blok M and elsewhere.

    ‘Er Indoors, a Batak, takes very strong exception to the notion that Indonesian women are “submissive”. If you really think that you’ll attract an expat partner with that attitude, then it seems that we’ve found the root of your problem.

    You might be 40 yet you act like a 14 year old. Grow up for gawd’s sake and get on with your life, just as the rest of us have to.

    There are plenty more fish in the sea, some 100 million or so adults in Indonesia alone. Go fish girl.

    Alternatively, get off your high horse and try to do something positive in this life, because your negativity is a real turn off. You won’t get a life partner this way.
    ……………………………..

    Anita.

    Sorry about this tirade, but the sheer arrogance and gaul (sp?) of this lass really pisses off nigh on every expat – apart from Fred Floggle, of course – who gets online here or on Indonesia Matters.

    I was tempted to include her blog in my blogroll, but I tend to go for balanced viewpoints.

    Such as yours. :)

  13. spew-it-all says:

    It seems that we’re talking more about caucasian male and indo girls. What happen if indo man with caucasian girl?

    Chewwyuk, you might have hung out at the wrong bars. RSL perhaps? In RSL you can see alot of some old bastards playing show and tell with their mates.

    I believe, however, some might be after money but not always. Not only do some indo girls look for money in relationship. I presume some girls whatever their skin colour are, could do the same thing.

    As for caucasian women dating indo men, it’s very unlikely if there is stereotype emerging from it, particularly if they live overseas. But more likely the indo men will liken to gigolo if they live in Indonesia. Again not many people in Indo will think in this way…

  14. And there are “kampung” expats here as well, those who are extremely shocked how they become a star, how they stand out and how friendly people are to them.

    *books a ticket to Jakarta (kidding)

    ~Tuan Indonesian American Muslim

  15. Beauty is in the eye of the beer holder. If you believe it, then it is. Relationship does have a definition, actually it has a variety of them, but they all comeback to each individual. Who are we to judge this woman is classified as “ayam” when there are so many kind of ayam in Indonesia (Ayam Nyonya Soeharti, Ayam Mbok Berek for example…). What idea, concept, value or emotional context can we label one is a better bule or one is ayam with pembantu look? Even the perfect relationship is all about possibilities. And as long as we live there’s endless possibilities. Like the Indonesian proverb says “Because one drop of indigo stains the whole cauldron of milk.”

  16. Anita, thanks for the correction, it’s a typo, should be ‘said’ instead of ‘sad’.

    Jakarta Ass, better, read the posting carefully before you show your idiocy furthermore. Blurting out emotionally in other people’s blog like you do is very impolite and shows your level, which supports my original article in IM : you are one of those who doesn’t need to be taken too seriously. One of the “Kampung Bule”.

    Keep the world green, Man. Working for NGO, eh? Better not the ones provoking the locals.

  17. ChewwyUK said…
    Sorry to be bitchy honey, but you are living in Scotland, with a bule. you did what every Indo girl dreams about – getting out. Doesn’t matter if the bule is 60 years old, pot bellied, bald and senile. it gets you out of Indonesia.

    Of course when they are out they dump the silly old fool, and play the pack, looking for better catches. I know several Indo divorcees (and Thia, Philipino, Cambodian etc) who hang around bars in Sydney who have done exactly that.

    This is total crap Chewwy – if that is the case then you have been caught hook line and sinker.
    You have clearly not been to the UK in a long time – the truth is that when many of these girls get to the UK, they get a very rude awakening, they don’t end up living in big houses and driving exotic cars (OK , I ended up with a big house and a reasonably exotic car) . Most Indo girls who marry bules aren’t looking at “getting out”, just the possibility of being able to have a chance in life – Indo girls are much less money grabbing than thai girls, you need to forget all the stereotypes that you may have believed as true through hanging around two or three expat bars.
    Husbands who are married with kids don’t go to the bar on the piss everyday – they have other responsibilities, you’ll find that out soon enough!

    It really annoys me to read comments from people who don’t even have a basic understanding of bahasa indonesia yet feel qualified to make assumptions on the people – they don’t even know them .
    Aditya

  18. Chewwy has an Indonesian GF, and she has a baby by him.

    He didnt marry her though.

    Maybe he is smarter than he looks.

  19. Anonymous says:

    parvita and chewwyuk sucks. judgmental people, if there’s any ‘ethnic cleansing’ the ‘judgmental ethnic’ deserves it. there you go.

  20. Anonymous says:

    It would seem that somebody is using the same ID that I use on another Blog. Because of the spelling of the ID I know somebody is trying to deliberately trying to clone my ID. I can assure you that the person posting under the name ChewwyUK on this site is not the same as the ChewwyUK on Jakchat.

    As for Mr Anonymous .. happy Christmas to you too! The wedding is in June and my baby and soon to be wife couldn’t be happier.

    maybe I am as stupid as i look??

  21. ChewwyUK says:

    I taske offence to someone suggesting that I got a local girl pregnant and didnt marry her.

    I will.
    One day….
    Maybe….
    Perhaps…..

    • hey ChewwyUK…
      U have brought this topic to the wrong side of your extremely uneducated brain. You have come to the wrong side of Jakarta when you came here, maybe Jl. Jaksa where all poor bule like you try to get their pleasure fulfilled with a very low price. You might as well get so jealous and denying the fact that we are asian have the capability to settle down in our lives more than you could imagine in your whole life. For example many bule living on the streets while we are asian taking the job in your own country with good wages because of our brain and our highly educated family. All you can think is to say all bad words without having valid knowledge. So be careful;l before you embarass youself any further.

  22. Anonymous says:

    Yawn ….. Boring as ever I see!

  23. Anonymous says:

    still sniffing around shesca tho I hear…..

  24. Anonymous says:

    See ya! My policy of ignoring is a good one and not worth breaking.

  25. Geez…. I can’t believe that people still bitching about this.. Good work Nit :)

  26. Anonymous says:

    go here to find the man of your dreams, Parvita:

    http://findyourbulehusband.blogspot.com

  27. constant change says:

    I love johnorford’s comment. Why can’t people just leave it at that?

    I mentioned in the opinion
    I wrote for Indonesia Matters. I found going out with a foreigner in Indonesia was hard for me. He was a real lovely person, so it was not because of him at all. It was hard because people were narrow minded and doing the stupid stereotyping.

    ChewwyUK is doing exactly that. Not all Indonesian women dated/married foreigners to get out. That’s a misconception altogether. Some ofcourse do, but making such generalisation discounted that people do fall in love with people outside their racial background.

  28. Anonymous says:

    Narrow minded people generalize this because they really don’t know that there are better things to bitch about. Like how to get their ass smarter. Doh!

  29. I think that it is a very interesting and amusing article. Practically all its main points are true.

  30. Cornetbee says:

    i just want to know, where’s the guys hang out? instead of bugil’s?

  31. Cornetbee: lots of hang out places in Jakarta, depends on what kind of music you like, the crowd you hang out with, budget, and location.

  32. Bulehunter says:

    I think we all need to listen to Michael Jackson’s ‘black
    or white’ song. I’m pretty much sure he would rise from the death if he reads what y’all people bitchin’ about here

  33. please post a little more about this topic

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